going back to where it all started with Jolenta Greenberg

0:12 Hi, my name is Travis, and this is Bestie Approved. I'm obviously still here without Emma, but I do have a very, very special and exciting and, like, just all -around cool guest host that I'm hanging out with today. Comedian, podcast host, and pop culture connoisseur Jalinta Greenberg is hanging out with me today, and I'm so excited. She's just so fucking cool, and I cannot wait to talk to her. So, Jalinta, tell us a little bit about yourself. Oh, my gosh. Thank you so much for having me, Travis. What about me? I'm a comedian. I'm a podcaster. I got my start.

0:56 In podcasting, when my friend and I started a podcast for a podcast competition her work was hosting, and we became finalists, and we got to make a pilot of a show that I had a random idea for, which is We Lived by Self -Help Books. religiously two weeks at a time and then reported back sort of like reality show style with like clips from our lives. And that show ended up doing pretty well. It was called By the Book. It ran for years. We wrote a book about our experience. Then we shifted the show to be a bit more of an advice show. And then my podcast co -host wanted to branch out and as did I. And now I make podcasts about reality TV. i love it and that's that's me in a nutshell and it's the coolest thing and i want to get into the book a little bit because as you know i bought the book i sat down and like you're very right through it it's a good book it's an easy read if anything it's well so it's not too i'll get into it i will i promise because i i uh it's not heavy though but like there's a lot there like and i yeah yeah Yeah. But before I get into it, we ask everyone, what's the last song you listened to? Oh, shoot.

2:21 What is the last song I listened to? I'm like racking my brain. I think it was Joyride by Kesha. Shut the fuck up. Do you want to know what my last song was? What was it? Joyride by Kesha. No way. I swear to God. I just had like sort of an itch for it. So I put it on the other day. that's so funny i just got my apple music replay and like she was my top artist for four months in a row and i was like that that feels correct yeah she's almost always my top artist i love her i saw her in concert over the summer and like jealous i never thought i'd be this person but like she comes out and like immediately like i'm like just screaming crying throwing up like oh yeah and i was like i don't understand what's happening right now i don't know it happens it happens all the time no happens to me too i went to yeah but how was the concert was it so good she puts on a fucking show man like i mean up there she's a good like showman she's a great singer like yeah yeah and like i think she i think she really knows where to lean into like the fandom of like i i made it out of this like this horrible situation and like i'm in the audience with the lighters up and like the tears i was like god this is this is cinema but uh it's uh i can't i couldn't get enough of it but i want

3:52 to talk about your book for a second so you wrote a book with your friend christian called how to be fine and i bought it such a good book like i and i like i actually thought when i sat down it was gonna be like just like a silly goofy collection of essays like making fun of self -help books and like some of it kind of we do a little bit but like yeah but like it was a lot more than that and like i found a quote from like your section from the very beginning of it that like really resonated with me. And I'm just going to tell you, it's okay. I'm always two weeks behind. I'm always catching up on life. I've always been just, I'm always just a few beats behind all of life's prescribed normal milestones, getting to them a bit later than everyone else, whether it's getting comfortable, leaving my tissues at school, having my first kiss, falling in love, getting a real job. I'm always running behind. And like the way that I was like, oh, she and I are the same person.

4:52 Like I locked in immediately because like - Oh, that's so great. I'm glad other people feel that way too. Yeah, like, and I think no one talks about that. So like, that was really cool. And then your friend Kristen sounds like a perfect angel. And like, I loved everything about the way you described her because that's how I talk about like Emma, my co -host and my best friend, Jackie. So I - I'm glad that someone else has people like that. Right, yeah. You're like adult friends. You're the person I can go to for adult questions. Like, how should I repaint my house? Who's a lawyer I could call? What kind of insurance do I need? What is insurance? Couldn't tell you.

5:39 No, but Kristen could. Kristen could. And Jackie could. Exactly. But the cool thing I thought about the book, you broke it up between two sections of like more than two, but like it was the primary two were things that worked and things that didn't. Do you still have like one of those concepts that you still use today? I have a few. Yeah. I mean, I still stand by the like, if you. If you see someone like swearing by something as like the main cure -all or like the one thing you'll need to focus on to get your shit together, like you can, it's always fine if that doesn't vibe with you and that like doesn't move you to be your best you because those books or those like methods are usually bullshit when it's like, if you just wake up at this time or like if you just meditate for this amount, like the ones that have the like one key. if that doesn't vibe with you that's very normal they vibe with a select few and then it'll totally change their lives but like if it's not vibing with you it's fine so that's that's a key takeaway that i've always stuck with more on the what doesn't work side where it's like you know if if someone swears meditation is like change their whole outlook and it's like giving you panic attacks like then it gives you panic attacks you're not fucked up like it just doesn't work for you i think that's really cool like to validate that for other people because i think a lot of people walk away from like i i don't i don't know like

7:12 the that uh you the one he talked about the girl wash your face uh that the girl or the woman that wrote that book people like take her word to be gospel and like i look at that and i'm like are you sure yeah why Yeah, washing your face. I don't know. I wash my face all the time in my life still a wreck. So yeah, like I managed to brush my teeth and still like feel like a fuck up. So yeah, but you did it. And that's important. And like something that pretty much always works where it's like to get yourself out of a little slump or to stop like ruminating on something like, like doing something kind for other people or like giving a little bit if you can, like usually does help. If you have the resources or the energy, you know, that's like something that, that I've found like is generally true. Sure. So that's like some good advice, but yeah, the good advice is pretty general and it's like, be nice to yourself, be nice to other people. Like those things are always usually working. It's, and that's, I think that's the cool thing is like, I think when you get down into it, the self -help industry is like, it's really holding on by a thread because. no one has the answer and like It's all pretty general.

8:29 Like when you get down to it. Like, yeah, everything is just a repurposing of something else. The secret was how to win, how to win friends and influence people was like, you know, girl, wash your face. Like they're all the same. They're all about like manifest a little bit and like get up early and like regiment your morning. And it's like, yeah, it doesn't always work. We'll see what happens, I guess. Right. And it's also just like. Now that we're, I feel like so far in the future from when a lot of those books like were huge successes, like we've also seen the downfall of a lot of these self -proclaimed gurus, like Rachel Hollis's life fell apart.

9:09 She and her husband had a whole empire about like rise together and then they split up and like. he passed away like you know and things weren't good and it's like you know tony robbins is a creep and like they're all we you know they're all just sales people peddling their spiel we love a snake oil salesman here yeah um have you ever done the we're not really strangers game no pick a number between 1 and 15 uh 12 okay So the whole idea is like this, it's questions that like you can ask to like create deeper connection.

9:52 I actually kind of like this one. What has been your favorite age so far? Oh, shit. Um, what has been my favorite age so far? I mean, it's gonna sound really basic. But like, I really liked being 21. Being able to like, go to a bar or you know, I lived in California at the time and like go just go to BevMo and load up on like wholesale alcohol. Hell yeah, it was it was a very freeing feeling to not be using a fake ID to like get into places. And I just, I felt like, you know, the world was mine. I had a driver's license. license that was real and it could get me alcohol and i kind of enjoyed like how simple like it's a pretty simple pleasure that i was just like thought you know i've owned the world because fuck yeah 21 it is that's perfect legally buy booze I love that. I should evaluate my relationship with alcohol. No, it's not the conversation we're going to have here today because I'll just validate the hell out of it. I'm like, keep drinking.

10:58 It's fine. It's fine. Just whatever. Just make a spritz and shut up. Before we dive into Reality Roundup, do you have anything on your heart that you want to complain about? Do I have anything I want to complain about on my heart? Yes, this is... mine and mine and Emma's favorite thing to do. So I, I often tell my husband, like, I need you to partake in my pastimes, my favorite pastimes, which are complaining. So I, I totally feel you right now. I have a lot of complaints for Apple keyboards and them always typing the wrong thing. No matter like how many times I confirm I'm like touching the right letter on my phone. It just like, I feel like it just makes up a whole new word. And I fucking hate it. And it makes me feel like I'm losing the ability to speak or spell. And then I'm like, I don't know. I don't know. I don't know who's fucking up. Sometimes I'm like, am I stroking out? Or is it just spelling? Is it just like writing pretzel instead of people over and over? no and it's like i also know that like i don't say duck and like i don't know how we've gotten back to that when i'm right right you knew how i spoke you used to know yeah you siri used to get me yeah um I have one thing to complain about and it's these little goddamn smart labels that I bought where like, I thought I was, I was going to like, I was in an episode where I was like, I'm going to, I'm going to Marie Kondo my entire life. I'm going to organize everything. And it's these like little stickers that like have a QR code on them. Right. I was going to say they're

12:29 like scannable, right? Yeah. Yes. And like, there's an app and it's like, you scan the QR code and it's like, you tell it what all's in the box that has the QR code on it. And I did exactly what you were supposed to do with these things. And I. put everything i organized all of it it's the most beautiful organization system and then i closed the boxes i closed the app and i didn't think about it for a full year until i knew i needed something for christmas decorations so i pull out the app and it says you have to upgrade to see what's in your boxes and the way took to my email and ripped this company apart. And it's like, it's $30 a year. So it's not that, but it's the principle of the thing for me. It's the like, there's a paywall to get to like your own item information. Like that's crazy. And the way that like, so I emailed this company and they send me back an email saying, cause I said on the website, it says there's not a subscription required. And they said, well, access to like the inventory of the boxes as a premium feature and i was like i want you shut down this is like that black mirror episode they put out not too long ago with like um with rashida jones about how like you have to keep subscribing like keep upping your subscription to like have access to being alive but it's like it's so true though because it's like every time i get anything it's like uh what toyota i think was like the most recent one that was like if you want access to

14:00 literally listen to the radio that's not carplay you must pay a premium and i'm like oh my god in this economy like that's crazy that's wild here we are um always upselling us even our labels it's so annoying but um So this episode couldn't have come at a more exciting time because one Miss Jennifer Shaw is getting out of prison on December 10th. So Christmas is coming early. So I'm setting this to release on her release date. And it kind of brings the whole thing full circle. So I'm excited. Are you ready to dive in? Yeah, I am. And I just, like, I'm curious to hear about Jen when she gets out. Like, she was friends with Elizabeth Holmes, and then, like, Ghislaine Maxwell got sent to the same place. Like, what? Well, and they, like, bullied the shit out of Ghislaine Maxwell, I guess. Right, yeah. Like, I know she said, like, she will not be allowed at Shawmazing Yoga. Yes. It's like, ugh. if it's i i get i get she did really bad things with old people's money i get that she ruined lives but like if her bullying galene maxwell is her way to like make up for that i'll take it that's fine with yeah honestly like yeah being mean to a like horrific sex trafficker go for it yeah and i hope that's one way to redeem yourself yeah yeah uh but god so so uncool And

15:33 she is uncool. Like, I just want to say that, Ghislaine Maxwell, you're not bestie approved at all. Ew, no. But, so, this first episode, it's a two -part episode, and this first episode could have been entirely its own episode. I love the bait and switch they pull with it. Yeah. But, so, we open, and Jen's playing basketball with her son, Omar, and, like, something that's always bothered me about, like, like when I see into people's families and kids call like say yes ma 'am to their parents I don't know why that makes me so uncomfortable but like it's like it gives like stranger vibes or like yes like it just it really tells me like I was told to say this on camera too like I was told to address you this way like we had a talk before we filmed where I'm supposed to say that like there's another family that I'm going to bring up later that does this exact same thing oh good good But then so we head over to the Wild Rose Whitney's house and she decides that it's time to pull their stripper pole out of the living room. And that leads to them both getting onto the pole. And then like that was a double swirl.

16:45 Yeah. And that was the first moment where I was like, oh, I kind of see what Whitney sees. Like, I get it. I always say this, that, like, there is something, like, some little charming spark about Justin, even though he's kind of old, like, a little too much of a dad bod at this point. Kind of has, like, a little piggy nose. But, like, also there's something, like, I can tell he's fun. He is fun, but, like, I felt the same way about the dad bod, and then I saw him running around without a shirt on on Instagram, and I was like, oh, oh, there it is. There it is. But we head over to maybe gorgeous Lisa's house, and she tries out this, like, the meta quest thing that Henry's playing with. Yeah, VR game.

17:36 And she says she doesn't ever work out, but, like, she has. abs and like she's I was thinking that I'm like her body looks insane she's in workout clothes which apparently Mormons like to wear because they don't have to wear their garments under it so they like go around in workout clothes all day I think I learned this from Secret Lives of Mormon Wives it's sort of how you get around like that although Lisa dresses up in like outfits that she could never wear Lisa never wears garments so that's the other thing too that Emma and I got into recently where she gets very defensive about being part of the church but like i've never seen her in an outfit that would support wearing the like temple garments and i don't care like i want you to i think it's weird for a church to tell their parishioners like you have to wear weird underwear yeah yeah it's just joseph smith needs to stop that's just all right i mean he was he was crazy it's not not ideal no but we head over to mary's closet mary facetimes everyone except for jenny mary's crazy closet the the level of hoarding that's going on there i was gonna say it's like a 90s hoarding explosion but because there's so much space it almost looks organized or like she gets away with it because there are just so many rooms dedicated to her hoard well that and like it's all like i mean it's millions of dollars worth

19:07 of clothes like it's it's all so expensive so it's like oh it's like it's designer trash but i'm like The level of anxiety that I would get walking through that house, like, I wouldn't be able to handle it. I wouldn't want to touch anything. I wouldn't, yeah. Also, like, I have a running theory. I would need, like, someone more well -versed in fashion and, like, fashion lines than when they came out. But my theory is all of her stuff is from, like, 2008. I feel like it's all from a certain era and a little old. That's... That's, that's what I get from it. I tend to agree with you on that. And like, it's like, like when Ed Hardy and Christian Audigier and all that was really popular, it all feels like it's from that era. Right. I feel like she has a lot of like the neon, like graffiti Louis Vuitton stuff. Yes. Which by the way. Sorry, my dog's deciding to throw a tantrum. That's okay. He's perfect. Because she has half an hour until her dinner, so she likes to make it everyone's problem while she waits. Beautiful. Sorry about that. No, you're fine. Don't ever apologize.

20:24 You may have to edit out a Yelp here or there. We've had several episodes where you can hear Emma's son Jack sitting next to me just talking. The besties love it. It's okay. It's fine. Okay. All right. There is a tantrum dog here. But Mary FaceTimes everyone except for Jenny to invite them to a cooking class where the dress code is Italian street wear. And then Mary starts doing this Italian accent and I hate when anyone does an accent as a bit. It's so bad. It's so bad. And then like Like, I guess she doesn't invite Jenny because when they were all at the tubing thing, Jenny screamed, shut the fuck up.

21:09 And that's a type of disrespect. Yeah. Yeah. And we get a flashback to that. And we hear Mary say to Jenny, get your language right. And I was like, oh, oh, I remember feeling bad for Jenny in this moment. And I shouldn't have ever felt bad for Jenny, but there's that. Was her deal she was a big racist? I can't remember. Was Jenny's or Mary's? No, Jenny, but I think I might be wrong. No, no, no, you're 100 % right. Right? I was like, didn't she end up, like, abruptly leaving? yes so she did a whole song and dance with like white lives matter like that was that was jenny yes yes yes yeah because i was like she was sort of like edited out after a while because she made some faux pas yeah um but anyway so whitney doesn't answer mary's facetime for the italian cooking day so we get a quick look at the novel that she like texted her over the shoulder and like it doesn't like stay long enough to read it but like i just know mary's this person that's constantly sending like lines and lines and lines of text oh yeah well i'm like this is a party invite just be like hey we're having a cooking class dress festive here are the deets like but it's it is it's pages pages of words yes and then we head over to merida's house and merida desperately needs a manicure so she invites

22:40 jenny over uh So, for the nail techs to come over to make that happen in our living room. And, like, the leisure of Meredith Marks' life is just something that, like, I don't know if I aspire to it. Because, like, I feel like I would get so exhaustively bored. Right? Yeah. God, I'm obsessed with her. Throws money at stuff. Does whatever she wants. Like, oh, my nails are bad. Let's just have people come to the house and pamper us. and i have a lot of questions about the amount of money like i wonder like i know she's got like the the meredith marks like she's the boutique and like i know she's a jewelry designer yeah but seth worked for big lots when they were still around so like i'm trying to figure out like did did she i don't think anyone knows what seth does really like yeah yeah no clue no clue i don't know um but then jenny walks in and meredith's dog teddy jumps up to say hi and the reaction felt off to me and like because i don't trust people that don't like dogs like there's something about it for me and i'm honestly really glad she was fired after people found out about like that whole white lives matter song and dance so yeah uh and like she was on some for all of us well the dog knew and then there she was on some anti -vaxxer bullshit too like i like no no no if i ever dig into like jenny i fucking hate her i hate her but yeah anyways so um meredith tells jenny that she planned a trip to veil for her

24:11 family and now they can't go so meredith conveniently has this empty house it's for a cast big house yeah and i'll never what was that song and dance why i i i don't ever want them to stop the song and dance i love the song and dance of like yeah making up a reason like it's like when megan king edmonds was like my family's in ireland so i want to go to irish roots yeah yeah i could go up and tap someone on the shoulder and i'll be related to them i'm obsessed with that please don't ever stop the weird that that we are supposed to buy into as to why they are why they're going and it's so it's always such a stupid reason and they're like oh they'll buy it like yeah and we do we do we do i'm like you know what her family all of a sudden all couldn't go now she has a huge house and completely disregard the fact that when they show up it is Only marketing for this company that owns the house. It's like clearly a joint sponsored thing with Bravo, NBC Universal for this house. But I'll buy it. I'll buy it every time. And the more ridiculous the reason, the better as far as I'm concerned. I love it. But we head over where Heather and Ashley are going to lunch for Heather's niece's birthday.

25:33 And then we get the obligatory jokes about Mormons not drinking. Drinking, yeah. like the performative like i'm glad that they've like gotten away from that over time because i'm like god it's so annoying just i don't care just i don't drink or don't drink i don't care but like i don't need to joke about it um yeah yeah i know what you mean the uh the niece and her husband decided to leave the mormon church because like their felt their faith like started to fall apart and i'm glad that they're starting to like talk about some of this stuff because i think that mormonism is like and it's it's not for me to decide whether it is or not but mormonism really is looked at very harshly and i think that people get a bad rap like when they associate with mormonism so like talking about like getting out and like what that does to you i think it like gives it's almost humanizing in a way like when it comes to that yeah no i totally agree i was like we understand like there is there is like you know they are dealing with heavy shit and and like as much as they're like we're funny girls like you know we're sort of wholesome it's like they're also dealing with being like shunned by the community that raised them and yeah and like i really enjoyed when they toasted to the outer darkness and then heather explains like the different levels of heaven there's like celestial where the good mormons go then terrestrial where mormons like

27:04 lisa go that just can't quite actually do the full lifestyle which i loved that dig i've always said always It amazes me that like the same church that kicked out Heather because her husband wanted a divorce and kicked out Whitney for, you know, falling for someone while married. Also is the church that is like, Lisa, you're perfect. Never change. So I like when Heather explains a little bit as to like, no, Lisa like holds herself to different standards than a lot of people. And I know beyond the shadow of a doubt that when Lisa saw that, like, John got a dish thrown at his head. I do know that. Oh, yeah. Yeah. And I love the next level after terrestrial is telestial, I believe. And that's where, like, murderers go. They said, like, Ted Bundy and Jeffrey Dahmer were examples. And, like, I don't know that I buy any specific religion. I don't know what's out there. I don't know. But, like. I do know that if there's a heaven, Jeffrey Dahmer's not there. He's not in any level of it. Yeah. right and i know that is not going to be a level below him i know that and then below that is the outer darkness that's where people who have been shunned by the church go so heather's like yeah we have to like ask jeffrey dahmer for a seat at the heaven table god they're so self -important with themselves exactly and one then heather also

28:36 explains how self -righteous even she was where she talks about like her sister who had left the church's wedding and they were supposed to wear like little spaghetti strap dresses that like came up very high. Like they weren't showing any cleavage. They were like a tube top with a spaghetti strap. But she demanded like they make her a bolero jacket so she could wear her garments to the wedding. And she's like, oh yeah. And I thought I was so, I thought I was so much better than these sinners showing their shoulders. If you're in a place at your sister -in -law's wedding to go to a place of custom bolero, like you've lost the plot. right yeah like it's it's like this is what your religion's forcing you to do to like feel better than other people like it's kind of wasting your time and money probably it is and then like but like you see her in the picture and she's just like chest high and i'm like god she's so happy she got her way and is proving how superior she is yeah like and i know like i today in 2025 i think she would be probably one of the coolest friends to have if i would have met her in like 2008 or whenever that was gun to my head you couldn't make me hang out with her i would say i would have hated the shit out of her yes oh but now i love her who knew you know we're watching we're watching a bad mormon be born like before our eyes i do love the evolution of it too i gotta tell you oh i know but We head over with Jen and Stu where

30:08 they're going snowshoeing because Jen's therapist says she needs to spend quality time with the people she loves. When that means her assistant slash business partner, Stu. There's a lot here. Like, because it makes me wonder if they knew. the arrest warrants were out like that's number one for me they had where they they know something's coming down the pike and she's because she really is painting herself like you know i do all of this for you for our employees like i work so hard and don't have a relationship she works so hard doesn't have a relationship with her kids as much as she'd like to because she is putting a meal on so many people's tables like it's like the way she's like i had to do this because i i take care of your family you know that stew and like yeah we get the confessional of stew is so much more than a business partner he is he's like my best friend or whatever she said something to that right yeah and this is dear listener i'm gonna come back to this moment when we recap season three when she proceeds to say i i don't know who stew is like that man had his own businesses like at this time he was like her business soulmate so yes yeah and then it's rough yeah the whole thing it reads like sort of you know like a planned yeah self -commercial basically and like i'm glad they put in the part

31:42 about like oh he's he's so much more than that because i think it's It's really important to see the inconsistencies. And then it's time for the cooking class. So we head over to the Park City Culinary Institute and that's getting all set up. And the way Mary interacts with people that are at her service, setting up anything, is so wild to me. So awkward. And she's always like half... she's like seems very unsure and sort of like stilted but is always like sort of teaching a lesson at the same time yes the way she needs to teach like the owner of the culinary institute where to put a glass on the table i'm like i've i i have a friend that like that is kind of like that where she like lays out the silverware in the right way and i'm like i have i don't know where any of it goes i'm like i'm eating with my hands i'm from kentucky who cares yeah um but then Jen rolls up with Stu and she's on the back of a Vespa wearing an Italian flag as a cape. And then we juxtapose that with Meredith walking in with a leather jacket, like cut out in the back. And like, she's serving nothing but cut. Like I think she is so hot and like one of the best dressers. She looks so good. It's giving like, like mob wife at fashion week. Like it's very good. yes and like it's like it's so tight and i'm like everything

33:13 is just perfect and i'm like this this is what i want like this more that was like yeah that was like when she was on her peak blazer game you know it was it was it was a good time for her wardrobe it was um and then we get back into Mary's Italian accent, and she starts to throw around words that I think she believes in her heart to be Italian words, but I'm on... I feel like she's trying to say, like, tagliatelle or something, or, like, it's bad. Oh, bolognese. I don't know. The bolognese, and, like, the scusi, and I'm like, first of all, I'm on a 560 -day Duolingo streak with Italian. That's not a word.

33:55 What you're saying is not a word. She's making shit up. yeah but that i feel like that's the theme for mary honestly right yeah i feel like i mean once i'm i'm sure you're caught up in real time with salt lake as it's been airing and when her church reopens she's like i didn't have a plan i just just wing it when i preach and i'm like that's mary that yeah yeah i'm like of course she didn't have a plan no Where she did have a plan, though, was with Whitney because Whitney's riding with Heather to the lunch where they find out that they got completely different dress codes. And then we see the invitation that I know she, like, made one of the people at her church, like, put together in, like, Microsoft Publisher. Yeah, I would say, like, not even Canva. No. And it's, like, go to. Someone just clip -arted or, you know, copy and pasted some Google image search results. yeah and it's so bad but i'm like what's worse is the outfit itself where it's like go to go to spirit halloween find mafia ho costumes yeah and that was so mean like it was yeah she gave everyone like street wear pictures of like cool chic italian people and then gave Whitney like Halloween store mafia dumb slut costumes and luckily Whitney wore just sort of a nice like kind of oversized suit and

35:26 I like that she and Heather compare notes in the car and she figures it out before it's like sprung on her and she's like well that's not nice like I just my heart always breaks for poor Whitney i feel the same way because i'm like i don't think whitney has a bad bone in her body like even when she was doing the whole healing journey thing like i couldn't stay mad at her because i'm like i believe it all comes from a very real i was gonna say she always means well and she's always being like authentic her authentic self and her authentic self is messy but that's not like you know it's not messy aggressive or like messy to with you like if she's just messy It's messy. And then for Mary to like just go so out of her way to be so childish and mean.

36:13 Yeah, like high school prank. Yeah. Yeah. But then we get a cutaway to Ginny making homemade yogurt with her little angel kids. And this is what I was going to bring up later. They are so sweet. They were coached to act like that. No kid comes into a scene and goes, I would love to make yogurt with you. Can we please? No. but we get a confessional talking they're great kids I don't like the mom though no I was gonna say too bad about their mom but like they're little sweeties they did a good scene for their mom they did good and then we get a confessional where jenny's talking about mary being so elegant on the outside but being shitty on the inside and i wanted to think about that statement as she's rereading her january 6th and black lives matter tweets like i really want her to like take that in yeah yeah let's think about that yeah kind of kind of uh applies to you too girl yeah and then we get back to the cooking class yeah i also i just love that like we have been set up to think that this is the like climactic event is like mary and whitney coming coming to coming to a head at this class and and mary's upset because whitney didn't answer four calls in a row where it's like if she's still not available if she's not available a minute ago she's still not going to be available and she didn't return

37:43 the call and that's why oh yeah she didn't return the call that's why she gets pranked and so like and and we think that this is an episode title is about like i was driving carpool and that's whitney's excuse for why she couldn't answer and i just love that they set us up to be like all right this is the fight we're here for this is this is the main event and It could have been. That's the great thing about this show is it really could have been. I mean, we got some great lines from Mary that, like, I still say. Like, I call my dog, like, little girl all the time. We got little girl out of this. Yeah. Oh, my God. But so they're, like, this whole lunch is chaos. And, like, I can't imagine what it's like to work in any of these restaurants that, like, these things are. Like, person trying to teach them something. Like, no. trying to teach them something or trying to like serve them wine or whatever the case may be but like we uh so they're they're fighting we get the little girl moment whitney is blasted to hell and back she is wasted and she's like crying and like she just like sobs yes and she's like mary i love you and like it's come i think it's coming from a real place but like oh yeah mary looks at whitney and goes then act like it and i was like this is how she talks to people at her church i know that oh yeah yeah yeah that's i bet yeah 100 that comes

39:14 very naturally to her at this point But then Meredith pulls Whitney aside and then we get the whole rundown of like the insane text. And then Meredith decides that this is the right time to bring up the Cameron situation from the Fresh Wolf. Yeah. And I believe they had already talked a little bit about like because Lisa didn't invite everyone to the Fresh Wolf event. And like some people are upset. I don't think Mary or Jen Shaw were invited or something. And but then Lisa apparently invited a guy named Cameron, who was a member of Mary's church, who says, like, basically, be careful. Good luck dealing with her. Right. And Meredith was unsettled.

40:00 i'll buy that because like what i have to believe is happening and like what we're kind of getting confirmation in real time of is like there are talks in salt lake city about like this is a cult like this this church where this woman married her step -grandfather it is a cult And you hear rumblings of that, but you're like, no, I've met Mary. She seems wonderful. And then you can kind of like explain it all away with like, well, maybe she was brainwashed. Maybe this, maybe that. She was taken away at 18 by her step grandpa and bought a bunch of stuff, in my opinion, in around 2008 that like one or over brainwashed her. But like still probably taking advantage of people. So like. 100%. But then you get like the story from Cameron about, yeah, I mortgaged my house and I gave them $30 ,000. Right. Like, it's not great. None of it turns out to be great.

40:50 Cameron seems to basically says like, you know, they suck people dry, like financially. Yeah. And Whitney says she's friends with one of Mary's cousins. Yes. Who he has also said, like, be careful and just, like, never make her mad. Right. And that's where we start to get into Mary's church believes that she is God. Right. Right. And then we get a cutaway to the picture of Mama Cosby with Jesus. The Mama painting or picture up in the church. Yeah, with Jesus. And, yeah. That is one of my. Oh, it's such a good picture. I want it in my house so bad. It's like they're just chilling together and someone was like, guys, smile. And they do. Up on a cloud. Because you're with Jesus. Jesus Christ. But, like, that's another one of those things where religion is just a wild concept to me. Like, looking at that, I'm like. People look at that and they're like, yeah, that, that feels right. That's true. That is true. Yeah. And like Whitney explains, like they think she speaks directly to Jesus. Like they say, like Jesus speaks through her. So like they think they're talking to God. Yes. And.

42:05 they so they head back to the table where mary has now become the victim and she's like crying and it's the whole thing and she like looks at meredith and she's like you didn't listen to my side and meredith is someone i will tell you right now that i want around when i'm in a fight because like the calming energy that was like i tried to talk to you you weren't interested and that's okay god damn you're like shit that shut me down like yeah But so then we start to get the shots of everyone getting ready for the trip. Meredith calls Heather while she's trying on a candy bra. We find out. I know she's every every shot of her throughout this episode gets more and more absurd. um but we find out that meredith goes to colorado early for her dad's memorial service and this also comes up as a plot point later but um heather's now the leader of this road trip right but please dear listener this is something that i'm coming back to where like this is one where i feel really bad for meredith but anyway right um yeah baby gorgeous lisa is like sitting in an insane pile of clothes and like for for a two -day trip by the way right i'm like it's like maybe two nights like or one i don't know yeah yeah and i'm like i don't know who this is for like this this whole song and

43:35 dance but like she tells john it's rhetorical when she asked for his opinion and i was like john john understands his marriage i get that oh yeah he might just start he might just now be getting a little sick of it but like he does know what the arrangement is yes he's just a body he's he's just there to like validate her really and then yeah and then we step into jen's closet where sharif walks in and she's helped her uh says helping jen pack is the worst thing and i'm like give her 24 hours and see what you think oh there will be worse things oh yeah it's true We get to go to the sacred place of the beauty lab and laser parking lot. Our promised land. Heather is the first one on the bus because we find out Mary's flying private to Vail because she has a headache. Yeah, she has a headache.

44:37 Didn't want to get up in time to meet them at the van, so she's flying private. Yeah, and Meredith's already there, so Heather's in charge of this bus ride now. Yes. The Wild Rose shows up with a Shotski lover. Of course. Anti -vaxxer Jenny rolls up on the bus later. And then Jen shows up in her braids. She looks so good. She looks incredible. And that's the thing. It's always a dichotomy with Jen where I'm like... God, she's so fabulous. Why is she such a monster? God, she's so beautiful. Why is she such a monster?

45:18 She walks in and I'm like, oh, so striking. The star is in the van. But also it's like, Jesus, girl, what are you doing? Yes. And then her phone rings. Right. It's pretty immediate. Yes, it is. Seconds after she sits down and she turns around, she looks at Whitney when she realizes what's going on on the other end of the phone. She hears like two sentences. Yeah. Yeah. And she tells Whitney to turn off her mic. And you see her outside. You see her talking. And, like, I am so desperate. Like, you pled guilty. We all know what happened. I am desperate to know what happened on that phone call. Like, that's all. That's my only piece I don't know. Yeah.

46:00 I feel like we hear her say something, like, at the house. Like, she's clearly getting tipped off. She goes, I need to go back to the house. Like, I can verbatim, I can recite what she said. yeah and i i just i want to know what was said and then i like but what makes me even more uncomfortable and like gives me a lot more pause is heather comes out and she's like hey i'm so excited and then because that's the first time she's seeing heather and she goes i have bad news sharice in the hospital he has internal bleeding i have to go and i'm like it was so quick and it just came right out. I was like, was this always her get out? I'm going to say this. Like, how does she just like come up with it on the fly? Yeah.

46:44 It's like in a split second, you just hear her be like, I have to go Sharif. So like he was, I don't know what's going on. He was like going for like a quick thing and now he's bleeding. I have to go. Yeah. It was so, and it just came out so easy. And I'm like, okay and then so she goes and tells the rest of the girls like hey i'm going and that she leaves and like everyone in the moment is like i think a little bit in shock because they're like oh what's going on and they're like trying to figure out like do you want us to wait for you and she's like i might come back i'm not sure right because in her mind this is something that could like we can we can figure it out i can get out of this And then the poor producer comes on the bus and she's like, are you guys serious about not going?

47:28 And Ginny's like, let's just go. I hate Ginny. They end up talking themselves into saying, they're like, you know, she would want us to go. She'd want us to have fun. Like, we should go. And like, while they're talking about this, you can see in the window behind them, there's like people in vests. or uniforms of some sort and you're like wait what am i seeing and you hear the producer go you guys there's there's cops and they have the handcuffs out something's going on like this cop opens the door and like this is how i know like beyond the shout of a doubt this but this moment was like real real is like right you see the reactions where they're like what's What's going on? And, like, Whitney's already, like, is this a joke? Like, I love that Whitney's already kind of expecting strippers at this point. Yes.

48:24 And then Heather, bless her heart, is like, I can figure this out. Starts saying, I don't know why the po -po's here. Just gets out of the bus and calls them the po -po to their face. And I'm like, Heather. What's the po -po doing here? And you're like, no, this is real. They have like NYPD on their back. For some reason, New York is in Utah. HSI, what does that stand for? Homeland Security. Yeah. And so that's all happening. And we get the to be continued. god this is gold probably the wildest to be continued on in housewives history yes 100 i can't think of one more shocking and it's like even even you know when it first aired like we knew it was coming like there had been talk about they were they had cameras up when she got arrested and it's like but seeing it pan out it is just so wild every time was behind the scenes that no one was supposed to see where they're like getting set up and everything i'm like oh this oh i i love this yeah when they when they're like when they make it clear like we're letting you in on this it's it's so satisfying good okay so then next episode we pick up where we left off at beauty lab and laser truly a sacred place where heather's texting jen saying the cops are looking for you they said they need to talk to you And I love that they go through

49:57 this like, are they trying to help her or get her? Like, maybe they want to help her. That was a wild thing to me. I'm like, Homeland Security does not show up to help anyone. The feds aren't here to help. Yeah, we've learned that. But then Lisa immediately is sobbing on the phone with JB's husband boss. She's like, the SWAT team showed up. The police showed up. Yeah. Like, that reaction, I have a lot of questions about. This time around, I was really trying to pay attention to her. And, like, Lisa gets kind of cut off. Like, they're talking about, like, why were the cops there? And then Lisa says, I think it's way more. And then they get cut off because then they realize Jen left her bag of snacks in the fucking van. And they're like, oh, wait, are those Mint Milanos? And then, like, Lisa lets the conversation get steered that way. And I'm like, was she going to say, like, what does she know? No, because she has unhinged ADHD.

51:01 Like, that's the problem with Lisa Barlow. I know. And then she's like, oh, Mint Milanos. I love junk food. That's my brand. I would have that. Yeah. I would eat that. I love that. Oh, God. But then Heather keeps talking about how, like, the cops just needed to make sure she was okay. And I think she's being so serious and honest in saying that she thinks that. And I'm like, are you okay? I think that's when we start to see, like, I guess the sort of Mormon naivete they're raised with, where she's, like, still trying to see the bright side or, like, assume the best in her friend, where it's like, girl, like, you can't Pollyanna this situation into being... cool no no um then meredith shows up at this this house and she looks so kind in her blazer dress like this like tight like i've never seen her she's like peak meredith yeah yes um like she was only more meredith when she had that blazer bathing suit that she wore yes yes um Then we meet Crystal, the experienced curator who's wearing a fun hat. And like, I know beyond a shadow of a doubt, she woke up that morning and she put that hat on and said, I'm going to be a star today. I'm going to be the runaway hit from this episode, giving a tour of this rental house. God, I love Crystal, the experienced curator. Yeah. So they do like a, you know. sponsored content ad for the for the house they're staying

52:33 in and like the company that manages it and this this woman walking around going there there's really not a house like a single family home like this in dale and i'm like yeah yes there is i mean it looks like the one next to it looks very similar and they're all like big sort of flashy houses in a ski rich ski town right yes i'm like it's a ski resort town like the village is nothing but mcmansions like don't do that It's okay. Don't lie to us, girl. Yeah. I think she's lying to herself more than anything, but that's okay. Right, true. We cut back to the trip. Heather checks to see if Janice texted her back, and it would appear that everyone has accepted what happened, except for Heather, who's, like, waiting to, like... And, like, they're on some level, I can respect, like, wanting everything to be okay. But at the same time, I'm like, are you okay? Right. Like, this is the same girl that's going to, like, cover for Jen when she gets her black eye. Like, where it's like, you're putting too much faith in this person. Like, what are we doing? Yes. And then Lisa goes on to say she didn't believe Jen from the jump because no one acts like that. And she says that she's pretty pragmatic. And I don't know that Lisa Marlowe understands what that word means. That's true. That's the last word I would use to describe Lisa Barlow. And then Lisa gets back on the phone

54:03 with JV husband boss and says, and this is where I did the same thing you did where I paid really close attention after some recent stuff has come out. But she's like, Tony K and Ryan, two of the six lawyers, told her not to talk to any law enforcement without them there. And then she covers her mouth and does the, I think Meredith might know something. And I'm like, is she just trying to throw us off her scent? Because she seems to know the most about this. Or like, I don't know. I don't know. Right. And the women start speculating about Jen's lifestyle and the cash flow and like what the businesses actually are. and like Lisa has been like she's always been ambiguous and Whitney's like I've always wondered and Whitney all of a sudden turns into our like you know Nancy Drainer yeah where she's and she's like teaching us how lead nurturing works and like selling leads and she's you know she Whitney has basically said I always wonder how she had the amount of money she did she was doing like legal lead generation because it's not like that lucrative no it's Not at all. But like the funniest thing in this moment was Whitney going, how does she get her money? Like I thought everything that comes out of her mouth is like, it's comedy gold to me. She's so sweet. I love her so much. Oh, but so then the bus makes a stop and Whitney and Heather are on the bus talking about how Lisa's acting. And the way Heather was so quick to say, if she knows something,

55:34 that means she's implicated. Like everyone knows there's something shady going on. like right everyone knows it yeah they're not saying it like yeah i want them to dig into this like in this like i feel like someday something's gonna come out about all of it but like like did someone on the cast talk to the feds because like lisa keeps saying like someone tip them off someone tip them off and that get that makes whitney and heather be like did she tip them off why does she keep saying that like right or like well and then like how did they know yeah How did they know to find her there? Like, did someone on production, like, say something? And it's like, I don't know. I don't know. I don't know.

56:16 But I'm desperate to know. Like, this is like, I love The Housewives more than anything. But what I love more is, like, the messy, like, it's like, I want to know who turned Teresa and Jo in. I want to dig into that. Because they say they all know. Right, yeah. And, like, people, like, friendships have, like, been built and fallen on this supposed information that, like, we just will never know. Yeah. Well, and, like, Jersey's a whole other beast, but, like, the fact that Caroline Manzo can be like, yeah, I was in the room when it happened, and I'm like, tell me everything! I know, I know. Caroline, she shocks me. there's well there's a lot there to be shocked about but like that's neither here nor there so we're back on the bus yeah um lisa goes today's a lot like and then whitney sees the news oh i love whitney oh my gosh oh my gosh oh my gosh oh my gosh so i love that she says gosh the whole time she's just a little sweetie I do, too. Like, that's like, I specifically was like, oh, she says gosh. She's still not taking the Lord's name in vain. Yep, she was raised good Mormon girl. Yeah. And then we get the headline. Yeah, Real Housewives star. Go ahead. You go for it. Okay. Real Housewives star charged in massive fraud money laundering scheme.

57:43 I had the fucking chills. Yeah, they're all shocked. Lisa immediately starts crying for Stu. And she's like, I feel so bad. I feel so bad for him. And I feel so bad for their families. And Lisa's always like a robot crying. I honestly feel so bad. I feel, I honestly feel so bad. I'm like, who are you trying to prove it to? It's okay. It's okay. We believe you. Yes, I feel bad for them too. And then Heather. heather's like moved like so deeply and then we get a shot over to jenny who's literally drinking a beer and going yeah i don't have the tax i don't know yeah yeah and like they they are all just like on their phones and like they all are like weeping this is like a scene out of like checkoff or something all this like just the mood shifts instantly they're all weeping and sobbing with like open bags of cheetos next to them And they're reading aloud to each other. Like, she and Stuart charged with money laundering and fraud. Like, they're in custody. And then Lisa's like, should we go back? Should we turn around? And Whitney's smiling ear to ear and goes, babe, she's in custody.

58:59 She's been arrested. This is the best day of Whitney's life. Yeah. And then Whitney is later, she's cradling Lisa and Heather under both her arms on either side. They're on her bosom crying. And I'm like, Whitney is thriving with this news. Whitney is in her element. And then we get a cutaway of... I think she tells Lisa, I just thought she had a sugar daddy or something. And then we immediately get the confessional of going, I had a sugar daddy. And I'm like, fuck yeah, Whitney. Fuck yeah. Yeah, I love Whitney. Yeah, you're such a sugar daddy. God, it's so good. And then they're like reading through the article and Lisa's like up to 30 years. And Heather, like that was the break. She goes up to 30 years.

59:45 It's a real crime, guys. Like it bad. And she's, like, unwell. And, like, she's, like, she's in a place of, like, hood up and, like, laying on Whitney's lap. And, like, she's, like, not okay. And, like, I know there's a lot of room for criticism of, like, the toxicity of Heather and Jen's relationship. But, like, I truly believe this reaction is coming from a place of, like... caring deeply about jen and not wanting anything bad to happen to her and like she doesn't know how to reconcile this yeah no she's having a real hard time yeah yes and then we get a clip of the ring doorbell footage with omar coming out with his hands up and like i remember seeing this and being upset about it i didn't think i'd be triggered by it again but i was like i felt bad for those kids because like i can't remember yeah And, like, I don't think we ever found out what happened directly involving Omar. And, like, because there was a cousin in the house, too. Right. I, like, I want someone, I hope someone, like, showed up, like, Jen's mom or someone that was, like, I'm going to take the kids. They don't need to be involved in this. Because, like, that was really upsetting to me. No. And it's just so scary. Like, especially, I think that was still, like. kind of early COVID days or like not too far into it. And like, we've just had these black lives matter protesters and, or protests. And

1:01:15 we see these like young black boys being like run out of their house with men with like machine guns or with like men with like rifles and their hands above their head. And it's just so, your heart just breaks for these poor. like kids who have no idea what their that their mom is buying fucking leads leads of vulnerable people and tricking them into like buying a product that doesn't exist like i feel yeah they don't deserve that and you have to put yourself in the mindset of like what like first of all cops show up at your house that's jarring to begin with and then it's like what are you talking about my mom like what do you say and then it's like i don't i can't think of any other instance where you have someone that has done a crime and then the family is taken out like like i just i the whole thing felt off to me and i didn't like it right at all like i felt bad for those kids but yeah then production shows up at the house and like i can't imagine what that chaos was like because like you see like the cops pulling up and like you see the cop cars and then like yeah all these like trucks in the driveway and yeah and i'm like and like the the producer's like hey what's going on like yeah like okay and then like i i make a tv show here like can you tell me what's happening yeah and then the cops like you can talk to mr shot like yeah so yeah um we're back

1:02:46 on the bus lisa decides to facetime meredith and right right Back to this lifestyle of Meredith where she's hanging up clothes in this closet, making herself a home. She's an absolute queen. And, like, she answers the FaceTime. And Lisa just goes, it's bad, Meredith. It's really bad. And Meredith is like, what's bad, Lisa? This house is amazing. I love it. Yeah. That was more Lisa. But, like, you're going to love this house. It's so great. And then this is brand new information. To Meredith like with what's going on and I just want to take a second here. You're telling me like you expect me to believe that This production was going on and no one from the bus or from back in salt lake city called like holy shit there's a swat team at our at our site what what's up with you like keep an eye out in denver they might be up there in a minute yeah like yeah heads up yeah i'm sure there was communication and then like but whatever we're expected to believe that meredith didn't know god bless okay yeah and meredith but even though it's completely new information meredith's like okay Yeah. Uh -huh. Yeah. She's always seemed a little sus.

1:04:10 She did fraud. I'll buy it. Unphased. Yeah. And then we get the confessional where she goes, yeah, to find out someone in your friend group is being arrested by federal agents in the beauty lab and laser parking lot. That's shocking. And just smiles. Yeah. She's so. So. Meredith has always been like a riddle to me. She's my queen. I don't need her to be anything other than exactly who she is. Right. She doesn't give much. Except like subtle hints and clues. Almost. To figure her out. But then. she she laughs and she and then she goes while everything else is falling apart around us we do have a beautiful house here but i love you and just like gets off the phone see you later i'm gonna enjoy the house well and then they like go back to the bus and lisa says that she thinks meredith knows what what she's letting on and i wholeheartedly believe lisa knew something in this moment and she was like saying that to throw everyone off of her trail because i'm like yeah i kind of wonder yeah but then they get the news that jen was let out like while she's waiting for trial and uh they start getting into the concept of wait

1:05:44 hang on i skipped a stop in my notes okay so they like they find out she's released and then They start getting into the concept of like money and like what's going on. And Whitney explains that you can dump cash into a startup for five years and claim losses up to a million dollars. And this is a fun tax strategy that I've seen several times during my time working in finance. Really? Oh, yeah. People love to claim a loss like when they have a ton of money. But I know this is something Whitney and Justin did because you don't just know about this. So I'm like, Whitney knows about this because she's done it, right? 100%. 100%. Yeah, she's like, you can claim a loss for like five years. So you can just pour whatever money you want in and claim its capital. And like, you're good to go. And the five years is an interesting number that she threw out there. Because I'm like, oh, you know about where they start to track it, where they start auditing. That's interesting to me.

1:06:40 Anyway, then Jenny's going, well, that's capital. That's capital. And I was like, shut up. i hate you shut up stop talking you don't get to be part of this no one cares oh god and then uh we get back to the house mary shows up to the house and like watching mary do literally anything is is just it's like watching it's like watching a scene unfold that i i never know what's gonna happen and she's so funny to me she's like watching a bird learn how to fly like every scene or you're like i'm worried has she done this before interacted in this way or had a conversation like is she okay is she gonna break her wing like she gets there and meredith's just luxuriating in the bath and i'm like god yeah and like this is the this is like the tub scene where she like starts to be like part of my brand is always tubs and like it never stops like it's she's just in the tub like for four hours she's in the bath no and she really makes a choice to stay and and mary sweet mary loves her etiquette and she's like i think it's proper etiquette to meet people dressed like maybe maybe we don't dive too deep into what's proper mary but yeah yeah um but then they start to like unpack everything and mary's speechless and she goes i had no idea

1:08:10 and then meredith basically goes you didn't like right let's go we're all gonna play dumb here yeah and then i know at this time and like i think they get into it later in the season but they start there's a lot of speculation that mary was somehow involved in like being the rat and like what i do know about mary to be the truth is that she's the last person that wants cops like asking questions or like poking around yeah i was gonna say mary's not gonna rat like i i trust mary to like stay quiet yeah like i trust like as far as like not that she's in the mafia but like i trust mary the same way i would trust someone in the mafia with my life i'm like she's a locked box once you give her information and tell her not to share it like yeah right um and then i just realized i like missed a spot while i was shaving and like this is like i see it like oh i didn't really notice oh no it's okay it's cool like this is like my first time doing videos so anyone that sees it i'll be like i didn't know it's fine it's all good it's cool i'll just like turn this way um and then what happens next so all the women they also established i like that they're they're realizing like this must have been a longer term investigation if like the fbi was there like this wasn't a like like on a whim whatever it's like this has been like a year in the making or something or more and it's It's funny because I remember like Mary saying something like the FBI doesn't show up

1:09:41 unless there's facts. And I'm like, well, I'm glad she didn't say that. Well, Kash Patel was in charge of it. Oh, yeah, exactly. And I do like that throughout this scene, Meredith's bubbles are going away and she's just sinking lower and lower into the tub, like sort of covering herself more and more. I'm like, it was a cute idea at first, huh, Meredith? And then they're like, well, I'm going to go get changed. I'm going to go get dressed. Like, you go get your room, Mary. And like, I'll get dressed for when the other ladies come. But instead of getting dressed, they cut to Meredith pouring more bubbles into the bath and refilling it. Where I'm like, oh, she wants to be in the tub for their arrival, too. This is like a stunt that she thinks is adorable or something. Let me explain something to you in no uncertain terms. If I show up, I want Meredith in a bathtub. That's what I want.

1:10:32 Like that's, I need that. Right. She was like, I liked this entrance. Let's do it again. I loved her commitment to the bed. So then of course the ladies come and also find her in the tub, just like with Mary. God, I love it. And I mean, she was in there for hours and. It never got old. You know she was a little prune, but she didn't care because she is now being in a tub as part of her brand. Everyone knows baths are my thing. Well, now we do. Now you can't give her a room without a fucking tub in it. No. So we get clips of everyone calling their respective husbands and we find out. John Barlow tries to reach out to Sharif and never heard anything back. And I'm like, obviously, obviously you never heard anything back, but he's either internally bleeding or dealing with his wife being in custody.

1:11:37 Yeah. And like, I don't know what John would have texted him to be like, Hey, heard your, heard your bleeding. Also the cops are looking for your wife. Yeah. Maybe we. let them deal with that and then we like circle back i don't know um so crystal and her hat are getting the dining room ready for the ladies love her so much and then we like mary comes up and like sees that jenny's there and she goes i forgot jenny was even going to be here and she hates her so much she hates her so much the language she used that she like told mary what to do like no she did not like her god and like i hate that i also hate jenny because like mary hates jenny for very different reasons mary hates jenny because because because of the accent and because of like because she swore and like got some attention when she first got there like yeah but um i also feel like the food on salt lake city looks so good like every time They always look like they have, like, good American food. Like, you know, American fusion. Like, it always looks good.

1:12:52 It's the same thing on Secret Lives of Mormon Wives. Like, I think that, like, Utah is just, like, a food destination in my mind at this point because it all looks so good. No, it does all look good. You're right. Yeah. And, like, now I want dirty sodas and I've never had one. Like, what's happening? Oh, they opened Swigs in Indy. I feel like they have one here in New York, too. And I've been like, I should go. Go. I'm telling you right now, go. It will change your life. Yeah, I'm curious. I'm very curious. So they're all sitting down. Mary says that Jen's arrest makes her feel a lot of emotion and that she doesn't celebrate people's pain. And if you sat me down in front of Mary and you... like you're you're gonna tell me right now that like she's not thinking this is what you get for the grandpa fucker comment like that there's no way yeah that's true totally totally yeah and then meredith like it's it's quiet for a second meredith goes so what's everyone thinking and heather goes this is the moment i've been waiting for and i was like heather is me and i am heather i know that's what he heather really is our audience proxy when she's like finally we're getting into it Oh, God. And then we find out that, like, Jen was running from the cops and got pulled over and arrested on the side of the road. And they start unpacking a lot of their feelings about the charges. So, like, we know she got arrested. That's, like, one thing. And then we

1:14:24 go one level deeper, and it's like, what was she doing? She was arrested for, like, taking advantage of, like, old and vulnerable people. And then we start. being like ew that's gross like yes which is valid it's valid and fair that like we feel that's gross like there's there's nothing else to say about yeah yeah mary feels betrayed like i don't blame her yeah this woman acted like she was a legitimate business woman right but then meredith goes into pasture mode and says i feel like she's reaping i believe that or i believe what a man soweth that he shall reap and i was like oh that's like the church i grew up in like that oh yeah yeah not good but but like she's not wrong and um then she starts to say like i she never saw anything good in jen she was scared of her because she knew what she was capable of and i i i don't know i'm like i don't know i i i see her point and i agree i also just i don't know i just want it to not be true about i about her i want it to not be true but like at the same time i wonder if everyone was it like actually in such a state of shock because they were like we know something shady is going on here we know like it's probably a situation i don't think anyone could have ever imagined it was as bad as it like ended up being yeah it was bad yeah um but then we get the story about jen and the shawshad going into merida's

1:15:56 boutique and Monica Garcia was there and oh my gosh I forgot Monica was part of that yeah yes but yeah and Meredith's like you know I have had an issue with her before that was like weirded out by And yeah, she like said she missed a bunch of calls from Jen when she was in New York. And like Jen wanted to get into Meredith's store. So Meredith had them like open it up for her. And then she checks in with her staff afterwards. And they're like, yeah, she like bought a few hundred bucks worth of stuff. But also this green clutch that one of her friends picked up is missing now. And it seems as though one of Jen's Shaw squad stole a purse. right and then like i also love the cutaway where uh i think it was lisa was like what which clutch hang on which clutch and like they have like a whole like it was like the snake skin green little snake skin i had that but i have so many questions about that very specific moment where it's like i and i never i don't think we ever get confirmation to this but i i it was the same build as the guy that was like helping her uh get ready in her closet marula or marillo yeah yeah i'm pretty sure it was him but like i have a lot of questions about like okay so you bought hundreds of dollars worth of stuff what why was the bag taken like was it actually an accident like i i just have a lot of questions about that yeah and like meredith basically seems to let her off the hook and be

1:17:27 like did you borrow a bag too and then the guy brings it back the next day right and it's like so it what was this was this just a rogue guy who like likes to shoplift like maybe and like because that is a thing like kleptomania is the real things i i don't know but then we find out that jen's red flagged in the system at louis vuitton because she pays in cash and i asked one of my friends that works at louis vuitton if this is a real thing and she was like it is so rare that we have to do it but there are like very specific cases in which it happens so like I was like, oh, I thought Meredith was just talking out of her ass, but that's wild. If you make a lot of big purchases in all cash, people do get a little suspicious. Well, it's the big cash purchases and then it's returning them. That's the big red flag. Very interesting. Yeah. Yes.

1:18:21 And then Lisa says that being red flagged at Louis Vuitton would be far worse than the Fed showing up at her door. Please, girl. No, it would not. Okay, Lisa. Let's be real. I'm like, this thing that you need to do, like, okay, whatever you say. Yeah, just like, just eating Wendy's and shopping at Louis Vuitton, damn it. Anyway. Yeah. you know what like i'm not gonna attack baby gorgeous right now but like yes that's her entire shtick is the is the windies and then like having money like right yeah i'm like having a perfect family that she doesn't really share yeah it's i find her boring i'm not a baby gorgeous stan the way some people are the way i like i go back and forth so hard with her because i'm like she's entertaining but i don't love her yeah yeah she's hysterically entertaining but i'm like there are times where i'm like why are you like this like you need to be talked to yeah anyway yeah i don't know man um well and then heather says she has a story about jen being sketchy that the uber story yes where Where she's like, I, she was at my place and I got her an Uber home and I went to check to see if she made it home. And she like stopped the ride and got out at like an intersection, like a few blocks away or something after like five minutes. I

1:19:51 have a lot of questions about this. And then Lisa wanted to know about it. Cause she was like, well, I wanted to know what, what day? Cause I want to, I want to ask someone if she was with them. And I'm like, does Lisa think that Jen Shaw was with like the guy she was rumored to like? give give head for jazz tickets for or something or like they have like a shared sugar daddy like I want to know why Lisa wanted to know what night what makes me even more angry because Lisa does this on a very consistent basis where it's I'm gonna let you know that I might know something and then I'm not yeah and then back off too much so furious yeah oh it's so annoying but I also why didn't Jen use her own uber app like that's something that like i've no one has ever been able to explain is like was she really drunk was that like i don't that's the only time someone's like gotten an uber for me like that like but like you would think if she was that wasted like i i would think heather would be like just spend the night here babe like yeah who knows that story feels off to me Right. It's just it's just that's where it left me with like more questions than I think had their thought that we would have. I think the whole this whole scenario leaves me with so many unanswered questions that like even after the trial, even after all of it, because like we never really got a trial. We had like all the pretrial hearings because like she was going

1:21:21 to she was pleading innocent until the last minute and then finally struck a deal and pled guilty. Yes. It's like and I. I'm like we never got to uncover anything because what I'm assuming happened and I think they say this like right after the trial like or after the guilty plea is there had like when they were going through the pre -trial motions they had to have seen something that was like there had to have been evidence that was so damning that yeah that they're like you can't you can't play your way out you can't say you didn't know about this or say you didn't do it like yeah right But that's the end of that episode. And God, like, this is like, I know people like think that housewives is trash and like, in a lot of ways, they're probably right.

1:22:09 But like, God, this is what, this is what I live for. And it's just like peak mellow drama. Like it's, it's. It's like it's no different from like I say, it's like very this one reads like very Chekhov to me, where it's like these sort of tortured souls and all these secrets being exposed through like legal action that no one wants to. confront and it's like it's a lot like it's firing on all cylinders and like we were satisfied with just a fight between Heather and Whitney I mean and we were satisfied with just a fight between Mary and Whitney and first and we thought like you can go little girl was like great and then we didn't know this was like right around the corner just Like, and again, we love the moments that are like, they're so real that like there were obviously this wasn't scripted or like nothing was fake about like producers being surprised by this and, and just everyone.

1:23:07 I mean, even Jen being surprised by it. Like, it's just so satisfying. I do like Jen being surprised by it. Like, I think the one thing like I've always asked myself is like. did she actually believe either a she was going to get away with it or b what she was doing was not like one of those two things has to be true right yeah and i want to know which one it was because like either one of them you're just like you're not smart or you were a sociopath like my yeah my i tend to lean towards sociopath and i wonder i was like i feel like i wonder if she had it set up in her mind like in a way that like stew would take the fall for everything illegal That's what I wonder. I'm not sure. Do you know that he still has not been sentenced? Really? No.

1:23:56 The way that I have done deep dives on this, because I'm like, I want to know everything. Because you know I'm applying to law school. I did not follow what happened. I just sort of assumed he had the same fate as Jen. No. Like... Did he turn on her? He must have. They start being represented together. I don't think they were ever represented together from the beginning, but I do know that almost immediately when the trial started, they had zero contact after that. It was their legal team speaking to each other. Stu was the last one to turn on Jen. I think that... like i that might be like his saving grace is like i'm i'm gonna get out of this like yeah save himself which sucks but like because because if you read like a lot of the court transcripts every single one of them knew what was going on every single one of them were putting people yeah yeah but like i'm just like stew is not innocent so like he's not innocent but he wasn't like the mastermind or he was only a partial mastermind like right i mean if he's if he's not if he's not equally as guilty as jen like he's still guilty like i don't care like yeah he was her like number two guy right but yeah that's that's that dear listener what a wild ride i always ask people this like if you had

1:25:27 to be friends with any of the women from the show who would it be oh i mean i feel like i would have the most fun bantering with heather but like my heart just says whitney I agree. I was like, I know she'd let me get on the pole and be real fun and sweet, like teaching me how to do it. And she just seems like such a fun time who always wants to see the best in people. Like, I love it. And like, I love that she's so like, she's so sweet and innocent, but she's also like a dirty girl. Like she's just like, like she's like. I would get along with her so well. I'm so glad you said that because I completely agree. Yeah. I love her. I just want to, like, hang out in a hot tub with her and, like, dish.

1:26:14 And just, like, tell her all my secrets. Totally. But this has been really cool. Thank you so much for coming on. Like, I have been looking forward to this. There's an open door for you anytime you want to come back. I have not shut up to a single person. sure but like this is this has been so great and you're so fun you're so cool plug whatever you want tell the people where they can find you oh my gosh um you can listen to my show hot masterpiece theater where we unpack uh our favorite scenes from reality tv and talk about why they're actually high art and why you're not trash for liking trash tv because because it's great and so yeah so i talk to fun people i break down like different archetypes that we see in reality tv and it's a good time so check us out at hot masterpiece pod on instagram and like wherever you listen to podcasts oh yeah i'll put it all in the show notes um also everyone needs to go buy a copy of your book it is that's so sweet i'm so like i i'm not like i want to start a book club just to revolve around that book it's such a good book But thank you so much for being here, Jalinta. You've been an absolute treasure and a gem. And I can't wait to do this again. Oh, my gosh.